Piriformis Syndrome?

Trigger Point injections, Myofascial Massage techniques, and many more.
cwb125

Re: Piriformis Syndrome?

Post by cwb125 »

benraycamp0 wrote: Sat Feb 17, 2024 8:32 pm Understood the reservations about traveling, but PN surgery is a very rare surgery worldwide. I would guess Dr. Echo is only doing these a couple times a month, if that. I would absolutely ask him this to see his volume. You want a surgeon who is doing 1-3 PN surgeries every week on average for years and years. If he’s only doing it once or twice a month, I’d really really really really (cannot emphasize this enough) reconsider.

Dr. Echo is a neurosurgeon so he’s operating on many parts of the body. Those surgeries are much much much more common than PN so double check exactly where all those reviews come from. For example I wouldn’t be surprised if out of 100 reviews he gets, only 1 was even related to a PN surgery and the rest are the more typical hand, knee, foot etc. procedures

I’m just drawing up some cautions to think about. I don’t know much about Dr. Echo beyond 1 negative patient testimonial, but we also don’t have many Internet testimonials or even PN literature/videos from him so some skepticism is warranted.

For Dr. Popeney and Dr. Skaribas - they don’t do surgeries. Popeney can help with medications and EMG testing and assist in navigating with other physicians. Skaribas is excellent for any nerve block or injection you want to try. Beyond that, they can’t help more than that
Yeah, one of the few negative reviews I found about Dr. Echo was something about "he wouldn't look at my pictures." I'm assuming that refers to breast implants!🤣
Camelote28
Posts: 13
Joined: Sun Sep 29, 2024 1:16 am

Re: Piriformis Syndrome?

Post by Camelote28 »

Guys, I need your help.

After the trigger inspection and PN block in 2023 with steroids, my pain in the buttocks and perineal areas does not go away. I have undergone many physical therapy sessions and dry needling, but I have had very little results.

Last Friday, my doctor performed a piriformis injection with lidocaine, and it has flared up everything. I feel a bit numb in my buttocks, but I still feel pain in my perineum area.

Now, I have pain rated at 10/10 in the buttocks and perineum, and everything feels on fire.

The question is: if I lie down and fall asleep, I do not wake up because of the pain, but if I open my eyes, the pain shows up immediately. Could it be a spasm that painful, or could it be PN irritation?

I am so scared and confused that nothing I do seems to work to relieve the pain. If the muscles hurt that badly, how long will it take to calm down?

The internet says it will go away in a week, but in my case, the flare seems to last longer. Any tips?

Thank you!
April
Posts: 670
Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2015 9:59 am

Re: Piriformis Syndrome?

Post by April »

Hi Camelote,

I'm so sorry about the flare. So your doctor injected lidocaine into your piriformis. That sounds like a nerve block aimed at the pudendal nerve that included only lidocaine (no steroid, right?). Did you have any reduction in pain? If not, the doctor may not have actually hit the nerve, something that is more likely when they aren't using imagery to direct the needle. Was the doctor giving you the block diagnostic purposes, or was it supposed to create pain relief (beyond the day when injected)? Violet recently posted a link to a study showing that nerve blocks (which usually have both lidocaine and a steroid) are not effective at reducing pn pain. I don't think I've heard of doctors injecting lidocaine with the hope that that would have any benefit beyond the day it's injected since lidocaine wears off quickly. Either way, your experience is consistent with the findings from that study. But you are asking about the flare. A flare is (based on my experience and those that I've read about on here) common. I definitely had them from my two blocks, although I had both lidocaine and a steroid. I don't remember how long they lasted, but I would guess several days---maybe close to a week. It sounds like it was almost a week when you posted. How are you feeling now? Have you tried heat (heating pad on high) to calm it down and reduce the pain?

April
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Violet M
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Re: Piriformis Syndrome?

Post by Violet M »

Camelote28 wrote: Thu Apr 17, 2025 8:56 pm
After the trigger inspection and PN block in 2023 with steroids, my pain in the buttocks and perineal areas does not go away. I have undergone many physical therapy sessions and dry needling, but I have had very little results.

Last Friday, my doctor performed a piriformis injection with lidocaine, and it has flared up everything. I feel a bit numb in my buttocks, but I still feel pain in my perineum area.

Now, I have pain rated at 10/10 in the buttocks and perineum, and everything feels on fire.

The question is: if I lie down and fall asleep, I do not wake up because of the pain, but if I open my eyes, the pain shows up immediately. Could it be a spasm that painful, or could it be PN irritation?

I am so scared and confused that nothing I do seems to work to relieve the pain. If the muscles hurt that badly, how long will it take to calm down?
I can't say for sure if what you are experiencing is a muscle spasm or PN irritation. There can be pudendal nerve entrapment at the piriformis level but I don't know if your injection was given close to the pudendal nerve or into the piriformis muscle itself to relieve muscle pain.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/books/NBK544272/
If the injection contained a steroid and was given close to the pudendal nerve, it could absolutely cause a flare up in pain. My pudendal nerve steroid injections caused flare-ups that lasted up to a month.

I went back and looked at some of your previous posts but I couldn't tell for sure if you ever had a pudendal nerve block that gave you some relief for even just a few hours. Having temporary relief after a pudendal nerve injection is important in helping to determine your diagnosis. However; I'm not a big fan of getting lots of injections for therapeutic purposes as opposed for diagnostic purposes, because I know of too many people who had numerous injections that just made them worse. Hopefully your pain will calm down soon but I wouldn't be seriously concerned for at least a month to see if it will calm down. You can try gel ice packs, alternating heat and ice, or just heat as April suggested, and see what seems to help the most. Alternating hot/cold sitz baths can help with healing because they stimulate blood flow and removal of toxins to the area. If you have a nerve entrapment, heat and ice aren't likely to provide any long term healing because with an entrapment, the nerve just continues to be irritated by whatever is entrapping it.

Regarding PT, if it isn't helping does it make sense to continue it?

Violet
PNE since 2002. Started from weightlifting. PNE surgery from Dr. Bautrant, Oct 2004. Pain now is usually a 0 and I can sit for hours on certain chairs. No longer take medication for PNE. Can work full time and do "The Firm" exercise program. 99% cured from PGAD. PNE surgery was right for me but it might not be for you. Do your research.
Camelote28
Posts: 13
Joined: Sun Sep 29, 2024 1:16 am

Re: Piriformis Syndrome?

Post by Camelote28 »

April, Violet thank you for a reply !!

My piriformis muscle was in spasm after the trigger point injection and the PN back in 2023. After that nerve block, I felt worse than before the injection. I would say, that the nerve block wasn’t helpful at all. Just brought more problems and stress. My muscles were numb almost a year.
After I refuse to do anything like injecting my pelvic floor because I am very scared of experiencing pain again. Sitting is my big problem. Sometimes my bladder hurts but much better than it was before. Sometimes I don’t feel my bladder at all. When I lay down my pain goes down and if I am not have anxiety than I could sleep all night.
However, I did physical therapy with dry needling, which gave me some relief from muscle spasms.
I told my doctor about it, and she said let's try injecting the piriformis muscle to help relax it, using deep dry needling with lidocaine. She said it was safe and that she wouldn’t be close to the nerves. She performed the procedure with ultrasound, and I felt a 3/10 pain level two days after and jumped up to 10/10 for almost a week. Now I am 6/10
Now I am still in a flare, but I don’t have those strong muscle spasms. However, the burning sensation is still there. Mu buttocks don’t hurt anymore, but V area, urethra still in burning condition and the superficial transverse perineum muscle in spasm and does not go away.
I started to speak with psychiatrists who work with people who have chronic pain, depression, and anxiety.
Because all my tests came back negative and nothing shows that there is a problem, he suggested learning about nociplastic pain and starting to work on how to retrain my brain to react to pain.
My pain management doctor recommended avoiding all activities for six weeks. I use heat and cold therapy, and I take Lyrica and Lexapro.
To be honest, with Lexapro, I have experienced some relief after many years of anxiety and pain.
I understand that maybe I won’t be pain-free, but I would like to manage my pain and not feel down every time I experience a flare up .
Maybe you know how ppl live with nociplastic pain, and any recommendations what to do as a patient?

I guess my tissue is so sensitive, my brain lives in fear of pain that I can not fully function daily.

Thank you to being here for us who truly try to help yourself .

---

PS. My story of pelvic floor pain started in 2013 after many treatments for UTIs. Some tests showed bacteria, while some of them came back absolutely clear. After many tests, I started taking Amitriptyline, and my symptoms went away after 6 months. Sexual and social live was absolutely amazing! :)

In 2018, after heavy weightlifting exercises and very emotional conversations with my boyfriend, I got all my symptoms back. Since that time, I have had one remission for a month, but my urologist performed a trigger point injection with a PN block (2023) because I had a very painful flare up after intercourse for weeks. She said it would help to relax muscles and calm down the nerve. and it made my life absolutely miserable. Sometimes, I want to give up and do nothing about it and stay home forever.
April
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Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2015 9:59 am

Re: Piriformis Syndrome?

Post by April »

Hi Camelote,

I'm sorry that your pain (on Tuesday) was still at a 6. I hope it is has declined by now. Thanks for the longer history on your pain. I have had doctors suggest that my pain signals are off (nociplastic pain), but I am always deeply skeptical of that interpretation. I can point to the exact source of the pain, and it is always slightly tender, so it clearly feels like there is a small part of the nerve that it still slightly entrapped in a ligament. Nonetheless, I suppose that it's a possibility. Has a pain doctor evaluated you for nociplastic pain? It sounds like you have tried a lot of different procedures. But, I agree with Violet that the nerve blocks are a risk if they're not needed for diagnosis. And I also agree that physical therapy is of limited use if your nerve is entrapped. Have you considered pn surgery?

April
Camelote28
Posts: 13
Joined: Sun Sep 29, 2024 1:16 am

Re: Piriformis Syndrome?

Post by Camelote28 »

Hello April,

My pain went down to 4/10 in three weeks. I think this piriformis injection helped to relax my buttocks, and now other muscles are starting to feel better too. My PT said that we will now do dry needling in my perineum area once every three weeks to help my muscles recover and heal.

Also, swimming is much better now, but I only swim on my back. Walking is for 25-30 minutes. I tried straightening exercises for 30 seconds each time for the first time, and I feel slightly sore, but not in pain! Cold and heat are still my friends.

I was watching a YouTube channel when Dr. Hibner described PN entrapment, but I don’t think it’s my case. However, I am considering making an appointment with him in a few months if I don’t see any improvement. I am in MI; AZ doesn’t seem too far for me. He is my last hope!
Hanna
PS https://youtu.be/w2WM98CXMIw?si=bPAZg0qRf9O4dKIm
April
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Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2015 9:59 am

Re: Piriformis Syndrome?

Post by April »

So glad that your pain declined some. Yes, cold and heat are, indeed, our friends! What are the straightening exercises that you're doing? I avoid anything that stretches my pelvic area---seems to me like an unnecessary risk. I'll have to watch that video some time. I do think he is a great resource, so if you give him your full history (onset, symptoms) and any diagnostic information (e.g., result diagnostic blocks), he can give you his best sense of whether or not your nerve is entrapped. I think the history and the symptoms are the most important. Yeah, MI to AZ isn't that far. He will also do video calls. You know he doesn't take insurance, right?. But, if you are in an HMO, they may pay for it since HMOs wouldn't have a comparable doctor in-network.

April
Camelote28
Posts: 13
Joined: Sun Sep 29, 2024 1:16 am

Re: Piriformis Syndrome?

Post by Camelote28 »

Hello April, here is my list:

1. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=43Y8lpn ... AgxQFlJYkr) Please do not open your legs too wide! to avoid hip pain and perineum pain. If you have never worked with a fitness ball, please use a tennis ball (it's more gentle). Start very slowly and listen to your body. Thirty seconds is enough! If you already feel tight, use heat before this program. It is normal to feel sore the next day.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=si8CQdX ... gx&index=4 - 10 times each movement! also , not too wide. sorry I am Russian and this doc explain how to relieve sciatic nerve and PN

2. The wall series are good too. If you do not know this program, I will try to explain it in more detail.

3. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MSad45F ... kr&index=6 I like him; he explains very well how to avoid the fear of the pain. he is better than my psychiatrist -)

4. Swimming on your back is amazing because you will feel so relaxed afterward, but it can also tone your muscles. Weakness in our muscles can lead to pain too.

I do the following: Monday I have PT (dry needling to my perineum area), Wednesday (pool) you can skip swimming, but cold water makes me feel so good - swimming for 25 minutes + 10 minutes in the hot Jacuzzi. Saturday - mini yoga or sciatic relaxation (YouTube video). I walk every day because I have a dog. She is my motivator.

If you feel anxiety, talk to yourself that any slow movements are safe. I don't do anything in the evening before I go to sleep because I will be too nervous about soreness and pain, and it will disturb my sleep.

I hope it will help
hanna
Pain 3/10
Lirica 50 mg
Lexapro 7.5mg
Tylenol on and off
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