Health Organization for Pudendal Education

Charlie wrote:As regards your statement I have quoted above I would say some PTs do not want to hear about nerves but if you asked any neurosurgeon about this problem they would agree that often myofascial problems are secondary to nerve pain. If you have adhesions on a nerve then your muscles will tense up in response. That is not an opinion but proven fact.

HI Charlie,
In my case, the reverse was actually true. My (former?) PT was the one who diagnosed the PNE. The arms length list of "ololgists" are the ones who were unyielding in their belief that what was wrong with me was "unexplained MPPS". These are the docs, neurologists included, that didn't want to hear about the nerve pain. Completely and utterly dismissed it.
Wouldn't even begin to entertain the notion that my "mysteriously clenched muscles" could be the result of nerve pain.
So, I sincerely appreciate your response, Charlie. For the longest time, I felt like the biggest idiot and that I was crazy.
And I do agree with you that appropriate PT has significant value, but limitations do need to be observed!
Warm regards,
Karyn

I am very skeptical of PT being able to break scar tissue and free the nerve. I had 100 sessions of PT and no luck. And yes, all the therapists I saw were convinced they could help me.
I also saw Dr.Jerry Weiss in San Francisco that did his "nerve mobilization technique". That was just so barbaric. I always left his practice with terrible pain.

Hi Ezer,
Uhm, ya ... I can only imagine your pain. The mere thought of anyone trying to "break up" scar tissue manually is enough to have me hyperventilating. I'll be forever grateful for the accurate PN diagnosis by my PT. She would faithfully forward her reports and evaluations to my (then) PCP and my (then) UroGyn. I also brought my records from her to a couple of the major hospitals in Boston. Dismissed! So, after being fired by Boston, I sat down at my computer one day and started doing searches on some of the key words she used in my evaluations and that's what brought me to Pundendal.info, and then ultimately Dr. Conway!
Warm regards,
Karyn

everyone is so different ezer...as Karyn knows from a PM conversation we had, I went to Dr. Weiss too for 1 visit, and his "nerve mobilization" thing made me feel so much better for a couple of days, I found an article of his in which he described the technique, and now when I am in the mood for some crazy gymnastics I do it to myself at home. It gives me a couple days reduced symptoms, though certainly does nothing to cure me. So that kind of work can flare some people and give relief to others, there is no predicting. But I do predict it cannot be curative for somebody with severe PN. Fantastic outcomes (cures or near-cures) seem rare, but most docs do a have a few, and I have yet to hear from anybody who has had that result from Dr. Weiss. Personally, I think he has only made a big name for himself by co-opting what the pelvic floor PT's do, but getting more credit for it because his title is "Doctor".

Hermajesty
I am quite aware that many people are favorably impressed by Jerry Weiss' manipulations. I thought he was extremely aggressive and that did not gibe well with my pudendal nerve.
Everything they learned in that practice came originally from Rhonda Kotarinos (I was told by one of the PTs). I was there when she paid them a visit.

I don't doubt the thing about Rhonda Kotarinos. I think the man has gotten a lot of credit with a minimum of new ideas. The only helpful thing he did for me aside from the nerve manipulation, was to point out that the original source of my injuries, and similar injuries to othesr in my family, was from gait issues caused by Morton's toe...this of course, is the work of Morton, expounded on by Dr. Janet Travell, and recently popularized by a podiatrist Dr. Schuller. Dr. Schuller and Dr. Weiss are now collaborating on a book. I see nothing in any of it that makes Dr. Weiss a genius, just a good networker and businessman.

Just a little Rhonda Kotarinos trivia. She worked very closely with Dr. Simons, of Dr. Travell and Simons. Oh, and Stephanie Prendergast used to work with Dr. Weiss for a while, ( or I should say he worked with her.. and she trained extensively under Rhonda K.) and now she and her group do a lot of training of other PT's and she does work with her share of post-op patients. However, just an aside... a PT that takes a one- weekend seminar does not make one a pelvic floor PT. I think we often hear a lot of that from PT's as in " I trained with.....

Judith

PT can break up scar tissue if they can access the scar. My husband is a PT and he told me to "work" my C-section scar every day (twisting, pinching, massaging, rolling it between your fingers) and I did so because he said sometimes those scars can cause lower back pain in patients later on.

Needless to say, my scar healed very nicely... and he has helped lots of his patients with various scars. However, he is not a pelvic PT...

although I doubt pelvic PT can fix everything I do believe it can improve scar tissue some as long as it doesn't push on the nerve and flare it up more. I have done self pt internally and you can release trigger points at least. So it may help some, it may be able to help with scarring, but I if a nerve is trapped then pt can't help.

Update: I previously advocated for PN surgery here, but it did not help me and I have since deleted the post.

oops I double posted by mistake....