Severing ligaments -- does it matter?

[A's Mommy]

Thank you, Ali, for posting this. I am so appreciative that Dr. Hibner took the time to clarify these points for the PNE community.

Like I've always said, I can grieve not being able to run again and things like that, but I CANNOT give up fighting for as normal of a life as possible. And for me, the only way to that is a TG surgery.

A's Mommy

PS: I hope I can be of help to anyone on the forums. That is my true wish.

[ezer]

Thanks for the clarification Ali.

[JODDY]

Severing ligaments--- does it matter? It matters to me!

[Celeste]

Actually, Dr. Renney is in his 60s and still climbing. He climbed Mt. Elbrus (Russia) when he was over age 60; it's one of the Seven Summits. He tells me he's not going to go for Everest (the tallest of the Seven) but if he did attempt it, I can 't say it would surprise me because he's just really into it.

[ezer]

Between Dr.Hibner and Dr.Roche/Prof.Robert/Dr.Ansell/Dr.Wong etc... I see a difference in philosophy but so far there is not a discernible difference in outcome.
I appreciate Dr.Hibner's willingness to improve the outcome of surgery but I am wondering if the neurowrap, pain pump, reconstruction of the ligament do not come with their own set of problems. Off topic but some neurosurgeons believe nerve-wraps are just a gimmick for example.

[Celeste]

Excellent points, and I totally agree. I think patients want to know that they have the best possible prediction of outcome going into surgery, but we still aren't in a place where we know who will or won't get well from surgery. No matter how badly we want that assurance, wishing doesn't make it so.

[AliPasha1]

Hi Ezer,
At least none of Dr. Bautrant's or Dr. Hibner's patients developed SIJD issues.Dr. Hibner and Dr. Bautrant can vouch for that.That's one step forward in the right direction.Whereas the patients of both the Houston and the Nantes team have patients with SIJD issues all over the board.

As far as the results are concerned,there are no gaurantees from these kind of PNE surgeries and it needs to be evolved tremendously to get better results.Both TG and TIR surgeries are flawed surgeries with very low success rate.So as the ligament debate goes,either don't touch it like Bautrant's TIR surgery or repair it with Cadavers like Hibner.It is always Better safe than being sorry.
Regards,
Ali

[AliPasha1]

The biomedical publication from the University of Michigan drives my beliefs and all the suffering of the patients that I have heard after their TG approach from the Houston team as well as Nantes.Further on,Following is the presentation by Dr. Bautrant that was translated by Ezer I believe.
The first thing is to learn how the ligaments work and what is their purpose and why God created them.

http://www.engin.umich.edu/class/bme456 ... ligten.htm

http://www.pudendalhope.org/sites/defau ... comes.pdfe

Ali

[Karyn]

I wanted to share something I learned yesterday about Dr. Antolaks & Dr. Conways TG approach in regards to the ST ligaments. They make a verticle, center slice to gain access. Dr. Conway informed me that by the time they're ready to sew you back up, the ligaments are already rejoining themselves. For extra insurance, they do stitch the incision, using dissolvable stitches. Is this right? Is this wrong? I don't know. I'm merely passing on information that was presented to me. Something else to ponder in the world of ligaments!

[HerMajesty]

I wanted to share something I learned yesterday about Dr. Antolaks & Dr. Conways TG approach in regards to the ST ligaments. They make a verticle, center slice to gain access. Dr. Conway informed me that by the time they're ready to sew you back up, the ligaments are already rejoining themselves. For extra insurance, they do stitch the incision, using dissolvable stitches. Is this right? Is this wrong? I don't know. I'm merely passing on information that was presented to me. Something else to ponder in the world of ligaments!

Just to clarify, Karyn, it sounds like there are at least 3 approaches being used??? 1st is severing the ligament with no repair, 2nd is Dr.Hibner's method of repairing the ligament with cadaver tissue, and 3rd is the method you described above, in which the ligament is sliced vertically and sutured shut again without cadaver tissue? That is the first I have heard of that, also makes me wonder if these are the only 3 approaches being used. Thanks for sharing it.